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Original Post with Update: https://www.reddit.com/r/survivinginfidelity/comments/flbxt0/update_on_gaslighting_husband_who_wont_admit/
It's a long story so I recommend you read both links (there's a link within the link).
Anyways the last update where you all told me that I was crazy for staying I continued doing the couples therapy with my husband that was prescribed to him when they released him from the hospital for saying he wanted to kill himself. We went a few times, he never admitted to anything but he did provide the bank statements (though none of the other stuff I wanted bc it was an overreach according to him). At one point a previous argument came up during therapy and he stated that he wanted to approve all of my friendships because I could not control myself when I went out. I was really upset bc part of what I was working on was being more secure so I wouldn't be so dependent on him (I learned that I'm anxious attached and he is avoidant). I told him and the therapist that it wasnt fair that he wanted to control all of that but that what I was requesting was an invasion of privacy. He didnt talk to me like for two days after that. He stopped going to therapy bc he felt it made things worse, but I continued on my own.
I felt like we were doing better and I suppose I thought that maybe I had imagined things to be worse than they really were and perhaps it was my anxiety that cooked up the supposed affair. I was feeling more secure and in control.
Then I noticed that a specific date I had worried about (November 16, 2019) that he had a birthday listed and said it was a guy friend though he never ever writes anything like that down. Well that date always bothered me after we had the 3some with the lady bc that week was the week that he went over to her house a couple of times to help her mom out. And about two weeks ago I noticed on my google photos that in November 16, 2018 he left for a few hours from a farmers market we were doing to make more products (he's a woodworker) for the next. He's never done that and we really weren't selling THAT much but I never thought anything of it at the time. Now I was like, really of all days to leave it was that day? So I started feeling a bit antsy again.
Which brings me to yesterday. Another date that bothered me was June 9, 2018. I was away in Europe with my kids and mom. When everything happened a few months ago I snooped his google photos and found that he had been that day in Key West (we live in Miami). on our bank account there was no record bc he took out cash (which he never does either). I was worried about that date when the whole infidelity thing came up with the lady and worried that maybe he had gone with her. But all I had was a photo of Key West but no proof that he was there with her.
Yesterday I'm cleaning out old papers and I come across the statements from a bank account that was his bosses that he would use for buying things for work (he was a handiman for a very rich guy). June 9 was there and there was a charge at a Key West restaurnt. That was suspect bc it showed he purposely hid the trip from me (he only used that account for handiman related purchases). There was another charge that day, from a parking garage on the corner of where this lady lives. I t was $20 which is what they charge for overnight parking. Of all the charges on all the pages, the only one that he scratched out is the key west one.
So I'm pretty sure I can't ignore it anymore. It's too many coincidences. He spend the day with her in Key West and then spent the night with her hence having to pay for parking for his car. He picked me up from the airport the next day.
I confronted him with it and he once again denied that anything happened. He said the parking charge mustve been from another day but the date is there as different from the post date.
. I told him I was telling him all this to give him a chance to make things right, that I coudlnt go on without him being honest. So know he says that it seems to him that I don't love him anymore and I'm just looking for an excuse to break up.
I'm so sad bc I really wanted this to work and I had become comfortable again. Why can't he just admit to the affair and that's it?
So while I was out getting the mattress and the groceries I called him to ask him what we needed. He answered with the diminutive of my name and I knew that he's trying to act as if nothing happened. I got home and was hoping he'd be in the shed when I brought the mattress in but he was sitting in the sofa. The kids asked that the mattress was for and I just said for the back room. When I walk back into the living room he's just staring at me with a caught in the headlights look of sheer terror or surprise or I don't know what. I told him I had the groceries in the car and he helped me bring them in, but he was no longer acting the relaxed way he was when I got home from work.
Did he really think that if he acted like nothing had happened yesterday that I would just forget it all??? FUUUUUUCK me, I hate this head games he plays. I'm trying to play it off cool and not engage him at all about that. I already told him yesterday that if he wants to talk I'm ready to listen and if he acts weird about the bed arrangement than that's what I'm going to say but damn it this is so hard. I don't know if this is just more manipualtion or what.
I already called her back in March when I found that he still had her phone number in his contacts, even after I had asked him to cut off all contact with her and her mom right after the 3some. He said that he kept her phone bc he felt that he still owed her the car and that she would call eventually to ask for it. I was livid about that and he blamed me for always finding something to be angry about. That was the big fight that led to me asking him to leave and him saying he was going to kill himself. I called her the night I found her contact on his phone and she denied everything. And it doesn't matter, there is no other explanation for that. All I'm going to do is create doubt in my mind again. i don't need her to tell me what I already know.
We are married for 16 years, 2 teenage boys, and I own the home. But it's my understanding that I can't kick him out since we are married and I don't want to separate him from the kids, and come August I will need him home to look after the boys while they do online schooling (bc I'm working in the office so I can't be home to look after them). Besides the fact that he hasn't worked since March and we live in the worse place for Coronavirus in the entire US.
Yeah, I'm going to try some version of the grey rock. We're going to be living together for a while so I can't completely ignore him and I have to be civil because the kids are around but I'll keep it short and sweet to the point and no chit chat of any kind. And you are right, I probably would consider reconciliation if he came clean, but at the same time I think that if I had confirmation it would not be something I could get over. I feel like I'm done and this is the worse possible time to be having to go through this. I only go to work and the grocery store.
I get it, it's just hard to accept in my heart. BC it's not like he's a monster in other respects. He is by all accounts a caring person, not the most sharing, but caring and is a good father. He's never treated me bad on any other level, so it's just hard for me to wrap my mind around how someone can appear to be a nice guy and then do that level of manipulation.
It is different this time though. With those charges on the work account it's obvious that he was hiding that trip from me. We had plenty of money in our personal bank account that he could've spent the $35 from there. And there's no way to explain the charge for the parking garage. AT ALL.
Did I mention that of almost 800 transactions on the printouts, the only transaction that is erased is the one in Key West? These printout where printed at our home and have always stayed there, so the only person he could possibly want to hide it is from me.
I think for me those transactions are not explainable any other way when looked at together with the date it happened, the location of the parking garage, the fact that he didn't use our account (except to take out $100 cash so it wouldn't be traceable). Why would he do that if it was just a kosher trip to Key West.
This is the writing on the wall I was waiting for. It just sucks because I can't kick him out of the house right now. He's been unemployed since March, we live in Miami so y'all can imagine how the Covid situation is here. School starts in August (we're doing online) so I need him to be at home to look at the kids to make sure they are doing school properly.
It just sucks bc I don't want to fall back into the trap. I figured he would sleep on the couch which is what he did back in March when he said it was over but no he came over and watched tv in bed and then fell asleep. I feel like he's throwing it in my face or is trying to get a reaction out of me.
Just until we divorce. I already made up my mind that he’s a narcissistic individual and a master manipulator (and I used to think those terms where thrown around too much) but he truly is. I think it’s dangerous for me to have him around.
I'll probably make a separate post once I start the divorce proceedings ( I meet with a lawyer on Wednesday) but I wanted to give a little update here. Right after I confronted him on Tuesday he denied everything. We didn't talk much that day but Wednesday after work he was back to talking to me on pretty normal terms. Even called me by my diminutive when we spoke on the phone. I was like, does he realize what's happening. Of course he does, he's just a master manipulator. He's NEVER acting in good faith. I bought an inflatable bed and set in in the back room but he ignored it and went to bed earlier than usual. The next day on Thursday I told him I'd be sleeping in our bed and he said so would he. Discussion ensued during which I said we were over (he acted surprised) and he said I could sleep on the floor or wherever I wanted but he wouldn't budge bc it was his house and he paid for the bedroom furniture. On Saturday I asked to sit down with him and told him I was seeing an attorney on Wendesday that the best thing would be for us to agree on the kids and division of property so as not to make it a contested divorce and even more expensive. He said he was not giving up the house (it's under my name and my mom, she paid for it in cash). I told him that might mean having to uproot the kids from their home and he said, well that's on you, you're the one who's causing all of this. So he wasn't admitting anything. Rather he was blaming the divorce on me being crazy. I was shocked that he would risk hurting the kids just to get back at me.
Yesterday he approaches me and says he wants to talk. He says he'll agree and sign the papers as long as I let him live in an RV in the back (it's already there and let him have that side of the lot where the RV and his work shed is. I said I can let you work out of your shed all you want but you can not live here after the divorce. He said that's all he can offer because he has too many debts and has no where to go. Stupidly I agreed to it with the stipulation that I need to talk to my lawyer first but the fact that I even considered it shows me he's still playing games and I keep falling for it. I think my mantra for the next few months is : He's not acting in good faith. he hasn't acted the way a normal spouse would in this situation, even if he was innocent. As hurt as I am, I'm not trying to get back at him. I've even offered to sign over the rights to a vacation home we own in Central Florida so he can sell it and use the proceeds to set out on his own. I've told him that even after the divorce he can come and work out of his workshop.
I'm beginning to see him for who he really is. Someone that just wants to continue living the life without any regard for me. He didnt stay with me bc he loved me, he stayed with me bc he doesnt give up the house, the kids, etc. Now that I'm finally done he still wants to grift and me like an idiot I'm still trying to do right by him.
I don’t know if I should bring up that I’m going to see a divorce attorney or what. I get the feeling that he’s going to act shocked when I mention divorce. I mean he acted shocked and angry yesterday when I told him we were over and I didn’t want him sleeping in our bedroom. I don’t want to sleep in the same bed with him but I don’t want to give I and go to the back BC I don’t think it’s good to give an inch to this man.
I already made an appointment with a divorce attorney.
And I wasn't really questioning so much as updating that I finally have what feels like irrefutable evidence.
I'm actually a lot stronger now than I was before but don't underestimate the power that being in such a situation where every single time you say anything you are made to believe that it's all in your head. I get what you are saying, but it's easier from where you are sitting when you are tits deep and you have years and children involved. I'm not saying that I wont leave, just that it can take a lot to get to the point of finally saying enough. Before I felt like I had a bit of doubt but now no more, nonetheless it's going to be hard because I'll have to do it with him staying here and if you read my updates you know that he's a master manipulator and you don't just get out of those patterns from one day to another.
I told him that I’d be sleeping in bed and said so will I and I pointed out that the bed in the back room was for him. Well to cut the story short all the civility that he was displaying yesterday and today went out the window. It’s his house(actually not in his name) and he paid for the bedroom furniture so I can sleep on the floor or in the back but he’s not budging. I asked him why he couldn’t try to get along until he’s able to move out after this COVID stuff and he said oh are done is that it? Yes we are I said and he said well I have nothing else to say to you. So ok I’m sleeping in my bed just BC I’m not going to give him the satisfaction of having me sleep on an air bed BC I don’t want to continue thus charade of a relationship. I mean did he think our conversation on Tuesday was just a little joke on my part? At this point I’m not even afraid of him trying anything BC he’s just shown his true colors that there’s no way I’m having sex with him again. I’m already in bed so hopefully he’ll not come but nothing surprises me anymore.
At this point he knows the jig is up so he might not? But I'm done pretending that everything is ok so I imagine that by November 16 we'll be well into our separation or the only other alternative is that he confesses everything is is an open book which I highly doubt will happen. At this point there's not much doubt in my mind anymore so I don't care so much what he does anymore.
Thanks. I’m feeling a lot of unease right now BC he is acting weird. I came home from work and made coffee and a little while later he walks in from the workshed. I told him I had made coffee and he said ok and asked me if I had had lunch BC he had made steak. I said I’m good I already had lunch. He went back outside and that was that but when I went to tell him that I was heading out to Walmart to pick something up he said ok np and was just his demeanor was like if nothing had happened. He even followed me to the driveway to ask me if I could buy a few groceries we needed. He acted completely normal and I get the feeling that he’s trying to manipulate the situation and act like nothing happened. I’m going to set up the bed and hopefully he’ll get the drift and sleep h Th here tonight but I have a bad feeling that he’s up to his old tricks. And this made me realize that I’m terrified of him admitting it and asking for forgiveness BC then I’ll feel like I have to stay and give it one more shot. I don’t know, maybe I’m just nervous, he’s never been able to come clean before so...
So I noticed that on his google pay apps on the website, Kik is listed as a downloaded app (though I don't know if it's still on his phone). Is this app sortof suspect?
Also, we had the conversation yesterday around 11:00 am and around 3 he had clicked on a Plenty Of Fish ad on our shared instagram account (the one for his artisan business that I manage). I was like what the hell dude, give it some time. I get the sense that anytime he has trouble he resorts to women.
So you don't think I'm imagining it?
I am leaving him. I’m seeing an attorney on Wednesday.
I got rid of the gun while he was in the hospital. I have no idea how he’s gonna take it when I finally mention the divorce. He seemed utterly surprised on Wednesday when I walked in with the inflatable bed and was upset when I asked him to sleep on it yesterday BC we were over. So even though I made it clear that we’re over he’s probably thinking that I would never go through with an actual divorce. But the attorney will tell me if he recommends that I bring it up before he gets served.
I hope not but last time he did say he was going to kill himself and was actively searching for bullets but I think that was a ploy. That’s when I called the police and he got baker acted.
I'm just so afraid he's going to pull some weird shit. I need to be strong but he really is a master manipulator. That's why I am starting the divorce proceedings as soon as possible. I think the longer he stays in our home the higher the chances that he will get me under his control again and I don't want that. I feel sad, but relieved and I don't want to go back to him and his double life. Did I mention that back in the early years of our relationship I found an empty nitroglycerin metal vial in his keychain. Apparently cocaine users use nitroglycerin for chest pain. He claimed at the time (this was over 14 years ago) that it was for carrying advil. For whatever reason I remembered that after all this years.
He doesnt have it on his phone anymore (on his google account when I open the app it shows me if its installed right now) but he had it at one point along with snapchat.
No, it wasn't her. I meant that I went out and bought an inflatable mattress so he could sleep in the back room and all of a sudden he starts going to bed early to watch tv. He basically beat me to the bedroom so I had to sleep in the back room.
Are you asking if I’m feeling better?
Please read my update: https://www.reddit.com/r/survivinginfidelity/comments/i5f5d1/update_retained_a_lawyer_and_his_true_colors_are/
Hopefully he'll be out of the house in a week or so.
Gahhhh it hurts so much right now BC at least before I could sort of say that it was me overreacting but that overnight garage charge just can’t be explained away. It’s like my friend says, it’s too many coincidences and all the signs point to her. I feel sick. I don’t understand how he can lie to my face. Why doesn’t he just say yeah I did it and leave? What is the point in hanging around with someone if you cheat on them?
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I feel that last little bit of information on the Key West trip and the overnight charge on the garage just makes it clear as day. I think before I was subconsciously hanging on to some little sliver of doubt, but now that it is gone, and with how he responded yesterday, I am officially done. I just hope I can stay strong bc as much as I hate it we are going to be living together for probably at least the rest of this year. If he keeps coming to sleep in our room I will ask him to make a bed in the back room that we are fixing for my older son ( I have two boys and they currently share a room). Like I said, I've seen the writing on the wall and I'm done but I wont pretend that it's not going to be supper tricky the next week weeks.