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Rant: NSFW sub lets people post pirated content; bans all content creators due to "spam"
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It's getting really frustrating dealing with how many Reddit groups are banning content creators solely because they don't have automated mod tools; especially when they don't think through the implications of how they go about it.

I understand the issues of moderation of a group/platform/platforms (after all, I deal with the challenges of it on like 8 platforms and live chats on a regular basis; as we all do). I also understand that when the number of users approaches the millions having your automated tools ripped away is going to create some untennable situations.

I also understand that many communities (like this one for example) don't want a lot of commercial promotions, or want to curate for a specific type of content and that those tools were essential to doing that in a big group with a small mod team.

I replied the the message pointing out that banning me as a content creator as I was typing up a response to someone arguing that nobody should ever pay for content and specifically posting links to pirated versions of that content wasn't exactly a good situation.

I also noted that banning all of the creators that hold the rights to the images they post, while allowing the exact same content to be posted with links to pirated copies of it, is both a little upsetting to me as a content creator and is definitely against the Reddit terms of service, the DMCA rules, and if they can't allow any content creators they should also not allow any other commercial content or stolen content since ... ya know ... they're gonna have a lot of people getting pretty pissed and reporting them when their stolen content is posted but they get banned for trying to use it for getting traffic, posting more of their own content to benefit from the subreddit, or asking people not to post the piracy links to their stolen content and that might not be a good thing for the community longevity.

At the same time the back and forth I had with the moderator regarding this, was pretty absurd and had highlights of: - Their stating that had I asked nicely they might have let me keep posting there but now they're not going to because I was difficult - Their arguing that it was impossible to enforce a rule of "only on topic posts," but not "no content creators" while also implying there were no tools to automate any moderation. - I was trying to blackmail them by telling them into ... something (I never asked to be allowed back in since I don't make a habbit of going where I'm unwanted, so IDK where that came from). - It's not the job of a moderator to prevent their subreddit from being used for DMCA violations, or to regulate the behavior of the people using their subreddit - They didn't have the authority or ability to restrict people from posting pirated content - Restricting the sharing and posting of pirated content, or advocating others to explicitly use the pirated content over and as a specific replacement for the legal version, was me "not understanding how Reddit works." - I am unreasonable and cruel for mentioning that if their mod team of 4 can't handle over a million members due to the policy changes they may just need to increase the size of their team and promote a lot more mods to make up for the loss of automation - I am evil for implying that Reddit might shut down their sub, and explicitly saying that this happening would be devastating to me and the rest of the community I'm in was me threatening them.

Again: just a rant: I don't expect anything to change or men/civvies to understand my perspective or frustration; I just needed to vent about it to people who might get it.

Comments

Oh, the last twist of the knife:

One of the current moderators of the subreddit is a content creator who is, of course, still allowed in. Because those of us that are their friends are the "good ones" and the rest of us are "spammers."

[not loaded or deleted]

So again, I'm not saying you're wrong about self-promotion or promotion of content; I even mentioned that in the opening section of my post. Bringing it up is willfully missing the source of the frustration.

The second would be a pretty big issue if what you said was true, but it's not true. What you're talking about is linking to legitimately sourced content and embedding content from a legal source. Both of these things are explicitly legal.

Essentially as long as all of the following are true: 1. The content is hosted on the destination site of the link or embed.

  1. The content was posted without knowledge or a reasonable suspicion that it is illegally hosted .

  2. The content is not hosted on the platform on which it is posted instead of the destination source.

You're in the clear.

The only exception is if the content is linked to or posted by the rights holder/content creator.

In most cases Reddit posts are good because #1 or #2 is not met so the exception for authorization isn't needed. This is why Reddit can do what it does.

The reason this situation is different is because the mods were allowing and explicitly encouraging people to: 1. Post content they don't have the rights to 2. Prevent the rights holders from benefiting or participating in that sharing 3. Permitting and implicitly encouraging people to post links to pirated full versions of content on those posts while: - Actively dissuading people from buying the content legally - Intending that link posting to be used explicitly as a substitute for paying for the media. - Actively banning people who create the content - Refusing to preemptively remove informed and willful acts of infringement.

This is why I never said posting links to free samples, or posting links to or embeds of tiny 5 second or 10 second clips was the issue: that's legal and permissible. The active promotion of piracy and then banning the creators of the content that is actively and willfully being stolen is the issue.

It's literally a crime of intent without the deliberate will and purpose to dissuade people from accessing the content legally no issue would have existed.


I should note: I explained this distinction, and cited a legal article which clearly describes the difference and informed them of a variety of possible actions they could take to rectify the issue. Options which were all alternatives to allowing content creators to post there. These included: ban the practice of knowingly posting hyperlinks to pirated content, ban posters who ** actively discourage paying for content,* and ban posting any commercial content. None were about allowing me back in or overturning the policy change.

Instead of taking the feedback and note, and just not responding, they accused me of blackmailing them several times, insulted me several times, and then muted the conversation.

[not loaded or deleted]

Not the point 🤦🏻‍♀️

The point:

  1. People are engaging in illegal behavior which directly harms sex workers

  2. The moderators decided the appropriate way to handle a moderator shortage was to ban all content creators (they weren't friends with)

  3. The mods decided instead of ignoring my message about the reasons their decision was (legally) questionable to start a fight about it

  4. This kind of change has been happening all over Reddit lately and is not exclusive to this subreddit: content creators & sex workers are being collectively and intentionally run off the Internet for the crime of making a living.

  5. At the same time this (and many other subs) still allow the same content to be illegally posted by others for free often with a ban for the creator if they post the same content.

  6. If a link to purchase the pirated content and request people do so is posted by anyone; Often other members specifically find pirated links and post them alongside the legal links with encouragement to never pay for the content. Moderators refuse to do anything about this.

  7. Due to international treaties This Is Very Illegal and puts All of Reddit At risk..

So yeah, it's a rant. I can't do a bit about it. They are free to put their whole sub in danger of a shutdown. I did all I could to try and notify them of the issue. It's still frustrating when people steal you and your colleagues' work and income and then ban you for trying to ensure it's posted to your benefit and that you get credit for that work.

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1 year ago