I’ve been playing Climbers for the past week and a half, and already the amount of misguided, partially inaccurate, or just flat out wrong and misleading information I’ve heard tossed around my locals is staggering. I’m writing up this post to help eliminate this confusion when it comes to one of the most central parts of Ice Climbers’ game- what they can do off of grabs.

The Basics

Welcome to the Ice Climbers. For the purposes of this post, “Popo” will refer to the player controlled Climber, while “Nana” will refer to the CPU controlled climber.

Ice Climbers are unique in that they encompass two separate characters controlled by the same player. When the player inputs a move, Popo will input that move the next frame as normal, but Nana will only begin to act after a 6 frame delay. The player is capable of using properties such as this delay to cause each climber to perform different actions simultaneously. When the Climbers are performing separate actions they are referred to as “desynced.”

Important to note is that Nana will only ape Popo’s actions when she is within a certain distance of him. When she passes out of the “box” in which she will follow Popo’s actions, she reverts to being a normal CPU, whose main objective will be to make a beeline for Popo, even following him offstage in an attempt to help him recover.

However, when Nana grabs an opponent, this goes out the window. In an attempt to limit infinites and other degenerate gameplay, the PMDT made Nana herself choose which way she throws based on stage positioning.

• If within a short distance of the ledge (approximately one IC roll length) she will throw the opponent towards the ledge with either forward or backthrow as appropriate.

• If she is too far away from the ledge, she will immediately upthrow.

• If on a platform, Nana will attempt to throw the opponent off the platform edge, almost always using forward throw. If she is backed up right on the ledge, she will backthrow, but other than that instance forward throw will take priority.

There are, as so often seems to be the case with PM ICs, a few exceptions and edge cases.

• If Popo moves outside of the Nana control zone as she grabs, she will not throw until he re-enters range, and will then immediately throw as usual. This is called a “Nannaquin.”

• Exceedingly rarely, Nana will seemingly choose to pummel or throw in a different direction than would be expected by the above guidelines. Most players chalk this up to RNG, but the dark depths of Smashboards contain growing evidence that Nana’s throw and pummel choice can be player controlled in an extremely tight frame window.

Things you should NOT be getting hit by

All of these give you the opportunity to escape every single time (Unless you're a fattie, R.I.P.) The power of all these options lie in the mixups between them. You need to be very conscious of what ICs can do to you out of a grab and ready to react to whichever option they choose. Don’t just give up and decide that you’re probably going to take a big punish, but don’t just mindlessly mash and end up missing an easy tech and getting infinited.

Dthrow Dair- “He just hits me as soon as he throws me, I’m pretty sure its inescapable”

• Inputs- Downthrow, jump, downair, regrab, wait for Nana to land/l-cancel, repeat

• What happens- Popo downthrows, and Nana immediately downairs the opponent. Since IC dair has set knockback, the attack will push the opponent right in front of Popo and let him regrab. Then the cycle repeats.

• How to escape- Most characters can get out of this very easily. DI the downthrow out and Smash DI the down-air as far out as possible to put yourself out of range of a regrab. Hold shield and buffer a roll away with c-stick to get away as soon as possible. If you’re a fatty, the regrab is guaranteed. R.I.P.

• Beware the reverse dair- Smart ICs will notice that you’re consistently SDIing away, and overshoot Nana a little so that the dair reverse hits you. Normally, it would send you behind Popo, but with SDI inputs forward it’ll put you right in front of him for another regrab. Mixup your SDI if he’s consistently regrabbing you with this setup.

Dthrow Squall Hammer “Its like wobbling in PM, fucking bullshit”

• Inputs- dthrow, side-b, Popo dashes to follow DI and regrabs

• What happens- Popo downthrows and Nana starts to spin up Squall Hammer. Popo releases the opponent right into Nana’s multihits, which track the opponent and allow Popo to get a regrab.

• How to escape- Smash DI hard enough and either buffer something or cc the hammer and counterattack. ICs will need to essentially read your SDI to prevent you from slipping out of Nana’s attack.

Dthrow Footstool Regrabs

• Inputs- Popo Dthrow, Nana short hop, Nana hold forward to reach grab release point, Popo release, Nana footstool, Z (will input grab with Popo and nair with Nana), pummel as Nana l-cancels, repeat

• What happens- Popo downthrows you and you immediately get footstooled by Nana. While you’re in the stun from the footstool, Popo regrabs you. You eat a pummel from Popo as well as a nair from Nana as she comes down, taking big damage.

• To escape- People thought this was an infinite until it was revealed its actually possible to mash out after the regrab, since there is a gap in the cycle as the ICs waits for Nana to get back into position. DI the downthrow full out to make the footstool more difficult to land, and then mash like your life depends on it if they land the regrab.

Chaingrabs on DI in

• Don’t DI in.

Dthrow to Fair Spike

• Inputs- Popo dthrow, Nana jump, Nana forward air. Popo air reacts to the tech option and either jab resets, regrabs tech in place, or chases techs away.

• What happens- You get downthrown right into the thick end of Nana’s hammer, which sends you straight back into the ground. If you’re expecting another option or not paying attention, you might get jab reset into a regrab or your shitty tech roll to the ledge will get regrabbed and you’ll get infinited.

• How to escape- DIing the downthrow can make it more difficult for the ICs to land the spike hitbox from Nana’s hammer. You really just need to react to this setup and mixup your techs. Be extremely wary of teching into a position near the ledge since ICs will be salivating at the possibility of landing some jooosy handoffs

Things you will sometimes get hit by

Handoffs- “Yeah he can just use Brawl handoffs to infinite you, pretty lame”

PM Handoffs are much more difficult than the buffered handoffs that were possible in Brawl, and since they are only possible near the ledge they are much less guaranteed. PM handoffs are far closer to Melee handoffs than to Brawl ones.

Since the time characters spend in a throw animation increases with weight, execution must be faster on light chars and slower on heavies. To execute handoffs, Ice Climbers need to be close enough to ledge that Nana will throw towards it.

• Inputs (must be facing towards ledge)- Popo Downthrow, Nana regrab, Nana AI will fthrow, Popo walk forward and regrab, repeat.

• What happens- Popo and Nana alternate grabbing you and slowly move to the ledge

• How to escape- Lol GL. Only chance is to mash if they’re a little slow and wait for Nana to get back into position

Bthrow Regrab handoff- Like this

• Inputs (while facing away from ledge)- Popo Downthrow, Nana regrab, Nana AI will backthrow, Popo turnaround and regrab (1 frame timing on non fatty chars, does not work on Puff), begin forward facing handoffs/handoff infinite

Platform Handoff Variant- Like so

• Inputs- Hold shield and simultaneously press down on C-stick, Nana will spotdodge and Popo will downthrow. Press grab during Nana’s spotdodge and she will buffer a grab at the end, otherwise wait for spotdodge animation to end and then input grab at correct timing. Characters that are too light will not work and you’ll need to WD down instead of spotdodging

The Reacharound- This is why we don’t let Tinker name things

• Inputs- Nana WD appropriate distance either forward or back, control stick input will also cause Popo to throw in that direction. Input Nana grab at right time and regrab. Follow up on Nana’s throw.

• What happens- Popo will throw you a longer distance and Nana will slide forward to catch you. Often used as a setup for Nannaquin or to cover more distance for ledge handoffs on fatties.

• To escape- Try to DI the throw as far up as possible to try and evade the regrab. If Nana grabs but doesn’t immediately throw, mash that mf like button

Guaranteed Chaingrabs

• Sopo can chaingrab some people. Tough luck. Mix up your DI and go for a platform if available. Be wary of DIing all the way to the ledge as you can get fair spiked if you’re not careful

Platform shenanigans (Upthrow to regrab)

• Inputs- Popo downthrow, Nana regrab, Popo jump and waveland while Nana upthrows, Popo dsmash, grab, or other followup as appropriate

• What happens- Popo passes you off to Nana, who throws you up into the waiting arms of Popo. Can be used to set up infinite handoffs on platforms or as a way to land an upsmash closer to the ceiling so that it kills earlier

• To escape- The handoff and Nana upthrow is essentially guaranteed, so your best bet is to DI the upthrow to avoid Popo. He’s probably already committed to some option by the time Nana throws and so you might just be able to go somewhere he can’t hit you.

Happy New Year (Dash attack to up-b)- “That kills???”

• Inputs- Popo forward throw, Nana dash attack, Popo jump/double jump, synced climbers up-b

• What happens- Nana’s dash attack launches you up and leaves you vulnerable for a meaty up-b kill. Since you’re already so high in the air, the up-b has even more killing power. This setup is devastating against floaties and they can die off a mid-stage grab at 50% on smaller stages

• To escape- You might have noticed in the gfy that Game and Watch actually comes out of hitstun before the up-b lands. A lot of the time, people will get out of hitstun but don’t know that Nana is invincible and will thus try to hit her and just die when she tanks it. Wiggle out of tumble and airdodge or double jump to try and avoid her. By DIing hard away from Climbers, you can make it more difficult or impossible for them to up-b you after the dash attack (If you go far enough offstage, they’d have to risk a Nana death to try and hit you).

Upthrow into Fair spike

• Inputs- Popo downthrow, Nana regrab, Popo double jump fair spike while Nana upthrows, Popo follow opponent DI and regrab/dsmash as appropriate

• What happens- Nana tosses you up into Popo’s hammer spike. You get sent down onto a platform and are at risk of getting techchased into a kill move or getting regrabbed and infinited.

• To escape- Again, DI the upthrow being cognizant of Popo’s position. If he connects the fair spike, be ready to tech and remember to mixup your options. Missed tech is dangerous since it gives time for Nana to get to Popo and then you’re at risk of dying from handoffs. If Popo does regrab, try to mash out before Nana gets in position to start the handoffs

Handoffs into Fair Spike

• Inputs- Handoffs, Popo downthrow, Nana short hop fair

• What happens- You get handoffed at ledge until the ICs player gets bored and decides to send you off the bottom. Nana slam dunks you into the abyss with an assist from Popo

• To escape- If you get hit by this at kill percent you’re most likely dead. Your best bet is to try and SDI and DI the fair as far in as possible and either land onstage or wall-tech below the ledge (if possible, depends on stage). If you think the climbers might be sloppy on their timing DI the dthrow all the way out to try and change where they’d have to hit you, but lol gl

Handoffs into Up-B

• Inputs- Popo downthrow, Nana regrab, Nana’s AI upthrows, Popo Double-Jump and Up-B

• What happens- Nana tosses you up and you get up-b’d off the top. Classic

• How to escape- Not likely. The up-b is usually guaranteed. Try and DI the upthrow into a weird position or offstage so that the climbers risk killing Nana by going for the up-b

The INFINITES

Yes, Climbers can and will infinite you in PM. Don’t get grabbed.

I demonstrate these on fatties because they're easy but they work across the cast.

Infinite Handoffs- “Did I just have the hardest DI in of all time or what?”

• Inputs- Popo downthrow, Nana regrab, Nana AI fthrow, Popo Dash back, dash in, dash grab regrab (Don’t jump cancel!) 1 or 2 frame window on floaties

• What happens- It’s like handoffs, but, like,infinite... Works on platforms

• To escape- Off the blastzone

Big D Infinite

• Inputs (Must have back to ledge)- Popo dthrow, Nana walk forward regrab (must be facing away from ledge), Nana AI will bthrow, Popo regrab (1 or 2 frame link), Popo dthrow, Nana turnaround regrab (disputed what exactly he does here, I believe he does a turnaround grab out of crouch [crouch, then slam control stick into the 45 or 135 degree notch depending on direction and grab simultaneously]), Nana AI will bthrow, Popo regrab, repeat

• What happens- see video. Popo and Nana pass you back and forth. Looks incredibly painful.

• To escape- you should basically forfeit your stock and spend the time in awe at your opponent. This is incredibly hard to pull off in 3.6 with the changed grab release points and people are still unsure exactly what the inputs are here

1 Frame Glitch???

People on Smashboards have been talking about discovering a new one-frame trick to let you control how Nana throws or if she pummels. No video exists yet and I haven't been able to pull it off but more than one person has corroborated it so it is worth noting.

• Inputs- Popo downthrow, control stick to neutral, Nana regrab, control stick input in direction you want Nana to throw (either frame perfect or extremely frame tight), Popo regrab, repeat

• What happens- ICs get to control which direction Nana throws you, so you’re probably going to get repeatedly dthrown/fthrown to ledge until the other player can begin an easier infinite or kill setup

• To escape- pull out your phone, take a video, and post it on reddit asap. This would be huge if there was video proof of it!

Thanks for taking the time to reading my basic overview of what ICs can do out of a grab. I had a lot of fun writing it and recording all the different setups and techniques. Please ask any questions you have or correct any mistakes I made in the comments!

TL;DR: DON'T GET GRABBED