Subject: Classical Hook Material - long
Date: May 7th, 2007 11:44:23 PM (EDT)
Group: alt.seduction.fast.general
Author: Aesthetics

Hook - "What to actually say to make them want you to STAY more than they want you to LEAVE"

1) Mini-cold reads

how i do mini-cold reads is the same way i learned mini-cold reads. i'd pick one before i went out and just use it no matter what

learning them and using them are basically indistinguishable. you barely have to learn WHERE to insert them. they're good almost anywhere.

if you are thinking of using material but don't want to memorize anything really, consider these...

"you must be a bad girl."

"I can tell you're a bad girl. I know for x-reason"

it can be romantic-cute ("adorable", mock-offensive-cute ("dork", said playfully) or somewhat suggestive like "bad girl" or "evil"

this is barely even a routine-ling, a routine-lette---it's just a runt. Throw it in somewhere where you would have said something less memorable. And if delivered correctly, it's memorable. She may even pull her friend over like one of the sweeter push-pull runts.

the definition basically is that it's a name or label you give to her that defines her in a positive way, but that ultimately plays on her validation because it's not the typical "you're gorgeous"

2) Reversal and Misinterpretation (especially Sexual Predator Misintrepretation)

Misinterpretation is a great skill. Realizing the multiple meanings of things in VARIOUS contexts is a great social skill. It can clear up misunderstandings if used seriously.

It can also be used to demonstrate, where there is still probably no misunderstanding, an awareness that peoples' interpretations of something (especially when it was grammatically ambiguous, or semantically vague) can differ from the original intention. This can be done while at the same time searching for the most humorous interpretation, in real time, off the cuff. The combined effect is humor, so for example

“One morning I shot an elephant in my pajamas. How he got into my pajamas I'll never know.” -- Groucho Marx

This is frame reversal in regular, vanilla humor.

For PU, there are better examples. Basically if your're doing a mini-frame reversal, and it makes her look silly (positive but doesn't validate sexually), but isn't overtly offensive, it's probably not terrible.

One time I used a routine lifted from TD that went like this...

Me: (smelling her hair) Your hair smells nice... Actually wait.... do you eat SOAP??? (mock angry voice) HB I better not find out you eat soap!!!!

Notice the similarity to a mini-cold read in that she's dorky and doesn't get fully validated. Now we're starting to get how this can be made natural, hopefully.

You just internalize that one principle!

I think the interpretations to largely avoid are where a sexual interpretation is possible. (If anything, imply it, don't INFER it) I rarely infer/misinterpret a sexual interpretation but I don't feel constrained by this rule either. Mostly, though, I try instead to let the girl make that interpretation and then flag her for being a bad girl (callback humor, can lead into sexual predator misinterpretation).

Misinterpretation is the genesis of a lot of humor. It's frame reversal in miniature. Sexual predator misinterpretation is a powerful role reversed frame---it's frame reversal writ a bit larger, and it's a specific misinterpretation that is very powerful.

"I need trust, comfort and connection first" (general principle, not an exact script) is good.

Extended sexual predator misinterpretation is a killer routine but this isn't about killer routines.

Sidenote:

If you want to internalize a particular killer routine on a given night, that's great----try not to make it about your fake friend that totally doesn't exist, IMHO.

On the other hand, learn how routines like Jealous Girlfriend opener work in the first place, and when a REAL story like that comes up, and it will if you're creative enough to see the potential as a routine, then use it in similar ways.

End of Sidenote.

Occasionally a girl will comment that she loves the type of humor where you grab the frame of her gender. On the more questionable side, it's the most energetic way I know of to pipe up in a conversation about female fashion ("Oh yeah? You think that'd look good on me?" "Does this make me look fat?" and get an immediate laugh, though "most energetic" is not always best, and it can lead down the road to a perennial androgyny problem if not handled with moderation. Just remember that before playing around with this one, I think.

This verbal method can walk the line with gender-bending, or do very little of that I think. Don't mess up your neurology too much while learning this stuff is my recommendation. Take control, take responsibility, be the agentic force in your life. On the other hand, I think your average flaming queer is better at opening a group than a large majority of straight guys. I never did a mathematical study or anything though. Wait, I open pretty well myself. Oh noes!!

Sidenote II:

About "getting a laugh". People find it very unpleasurable to feel obligated or expected to laugh. This is probably why the very term "in order to get a laugh" can smack a bit untasteful to some people I think. Throw and go with material you think might be humorous just like you'd throw and go on something you think might be an indicator of disinterest. Both of these I think come off less annoying and decrease self-consciousness (so they can laugh) in the target/group (most of this applies to either).

End sidenote.

Anyway, add this to mini-cold reads and a form of "humor for use with females" begins to take form. It should be almost tangible at this point if you internalize the inner structure.

3) C&F frames (especially Kooper frames)

Okay here's the idea. You're cool. She's a dork. You have value. She's a bratty little sister-type.

Or maybe you love her eternally off the opener.

"Oh my god, Oh my god, I have something seriously life or death important to tell you" (hook)

"Well, I love you. (pause) I think we should get married and move to x-place and adopt x-animals"

Maybe you want to adopt llamas and move somewhere tropical with her. Add that llamas need a lotta love. BUT (the magical "actually wait" swinggcat qualify and see if she can really roll with you on these ridiculous adventures.

Important Sidenote III:

This is completely internalized for me. Now all I have to do is sprinkle some cold reads (which seem off the cuff) and use misinterpretation (which really is off the cuff) and then once I start doing misinterpretation my brain lights up and I go (SEXUAL PREDATOR MISINTERPRETATION!!!!)

Why? Cause by now I've gotten the IOIs necessary to make this devastatingly effective. I think this is where people fail with SPM

End sidenote.

Plan some Oceans 11 type plot where you both move to a Switzerland with the riches. Let her choose whether she wants the Cayman islands instead (illusory input, getting her to buy into the frame). Mention the potential trade-off in tax-benefits. Whatever. I've never used that one, it's just that this structure is gonna work with catchy adventures (a bank heist, which I have used in general) and good delivery. For example, really act mock-thoughtful about the tax-benefits and then move on (throw and go with your humor---that's your delivery right there). Point here is that the actual scripting of a new one of these happens automatically in field with whatever you feel good about at the time.

With this type of humor, make the details ridiculous or send it over the top in some way to 1) generate humor (it draws attention, sort of takes away validation and causes them to submit because it's pretty C&F) 2) reduces the creepy-ness factor and makes it socially acceptable, especially to other girls (because it's C&F----it's a C&F frame dude, that's how all this stuff even works---it's effin' GREAT).

Don't verbally plan an adventure that sounds like your genuine fantasy and expect that it's similar to any of this. Unless of course you can make that funny and non-needy (cocky is not terrible either)----because that would be the definition of hook material.

This is obviously a DHV and is obviously (to me) worth learning.

Think of your own (they're the most long-ish routine like things I'll talk about, and yet they still don't need to be written down because it's a frame---i.e. it's improvised largely). Think of something you'd be comfortable saying, but remember that sending it over the top (especially with good, natural timing) makes these quite appealing.

With misinterpretation and mini-cold reads, we saw the structure of humor begin to take form.

With C&F frames, the structure of the interaction (into which you put the humor you learned the structure of----you did learn that structure right?) starts to take a little shape. Just one or two of these will be plenty if a seriously good, positive, vibe is to be had from all of this.

The frames become killer because they're your personal NLP-style anchor to that structure of humor we talked about earlier and to all the other bits in this article. Your C&F frames actually anchor to various specific forms of swinggcat qualifying you've deemed through experience are appropriate situationally----looks really off the cuff, which adds the illusion of spontaneity and immense power IMHO.

The reason you'd only do two is first of all you shouldn't be memorizing tons of these, just a few and second of all, you shouldn't be effin' up your head by not dropping all material past five minutes into the interaction.

To do otherwise risks becoming a validation junky. I'm recovering, thanks.

4) Busting on Mannerisms (more like a bonus, I only add it because at this point I do this stuff naturally a lot)

Sometimes girls go to the bathroom together. It's worth at least a knowing sigh if you mention it. You can throw and go something like this easily by just asking "what's the deal with that?" without expecting an actual answer. These are random examples of things I hook with, not the tightest stuff in the world.

Sometimes girls will take liberties with you (especially touching, ass-slapping) that most guys wouldn't take with girls they just met. Make an ironic and humorous comment stating the consequences for men of doing this whereas women get away with it. Then think it over and say that "Fuck it" you should just do the same that girls do. Whether you do or not is probably of little consequence.

But fuck it, maybe I should.

Understand and demonstrate authority in her world in any way that works for you. If she relates to it, great.

There are some quasi-mentalist magical effects that fall under this too, best friends test being one of them, that adds other positive things to this whole "milieu". These can have a huge effect that's cleverly orchestrated, often through really intelligently reverse-engineered scripting the community did a ways back.

A subtle benefit of the best friends routine is that you understand and demonstrate authority in her world more than someone who will ignore her friend----even better, you recognized on your own that she was her best friend (they always are, but sometimes they really are, and that's good to know).

As you can see my own examples aren't quite up to par with best friends test, a classic.

And finally the big one...

5) Push-Pull (especially Swinggcat qualifying)

You can often push-pull, zig-zag, through a C&F frame for a huge effect, and the scripting does not need to be very tightly orchestrated in advance. This is the very structure of what I'm often doing on a semi-conscious / semi-naturalized level to hook interest.

Swinggcat qualifying, sexual predator misinterpreation, breaking up and getting back together (everything you have that's push-pull-esque) can be what you use to go "off-book" over the course of some elaborate Kooper frame for a killer effect.

When I've been keeping up good form, which is not always, but will sometimes happen for several days in a row if I've been going out a lot is that I'll just visualize two posts, or whatever mnemonic you want symbolizing you and the girl as a couple.

Move the posts back and forth: You're together, you're broken up, you want to get married, you want to move out and "I want my cds back", she's a sexual predator, she can sleep at the foot of your bed, etc. etc.

It's a way of getting a feel for where you are in terms of where you've pushed her validation. Don't go too far. End positively if possible, and play the humility card and mirror away if not.

Correctly used and taken together these routines can build a discernible (almost tangible) and advantageous vibe. This is really powerful stuff.

For me, using this stuff is like existing in girls' emotions, almost in a way you can reach out and touch. There will be bad reactions along the way that will teach you how to calibrate this stuff so that it works very consistently to generate IOIs.

But be warned that practicing these often and using bad habits will change your behavior heavily and in a negative way.

Some nights, to really master the hook material, I think it's worth it to hook and move on, meet everyone, see how many of the girls naturally discover that you've been using this type of humor on all of them. If they meet each other, and both declare their undying love for you, it's not a bad thing. Just tell them you love them all equally. Don't fall into the trap of choosing one of them too much unless there's real reasons in the vibe, it can't be just looks, or you lose value in many situations I think.

You should be able to recognize when you've done plenty, though, and when to be satisfied. This is a good key to vibing.

If this sounds familiar like it's a recap of Tylerdurden, it basically is. Mad props to him for years of diligent discovery---this stuff really works.

Some hook material can only be classified as general C&F I think. Of course all the above material is really C&F, but I got a makeout in under 30 seconds (she tackled me) with this line (which I invented on the spot)....

HB: Oh my god, ["this is so perfect" or "I'm so into guys like this" or similar] I need your phone number (I literally forget what I opened with for the first 10 seconds, no matter how hard I tried to remember)

Aesthetics: Oh, you want my number? It's number one. (holding up the number "one" with my finger)

HB: (jump) (makeout)

The rest of the time was making out but I broke it off cause I've never had that happen before. Ultimately a fuckup.

She was sitting at the bar in a crowded area so it was a little bit not my style to project sexual state and isolate based on 30 seconds, but maybe I should have.

Keep in mind (forthcoming disagreements aside) that this is not a case of a phone number I should have gotten. It's a case of me stalling, trying to even get her contributive enough to find out anything other than that she wanted my phone number.

It wouldn't have even been plausible because of how quick this was to go "Girls never call, you gimme your number" because literally the first and last words out of her mouth (at least before I was obviously in the fuckup zone) are printed for you to see.

The moral of the story attract material works, but the point is to come up on the fly with something perfect for the situation (C&F lines in general) so that it's just part of your personality.

C&F material largely consists of breaking rapport humorously. In the case of my makeout though, the only way to maintain her interest anymore (or else risk underqualifying her and maybe even raising ASD instead of good feelings) is to show with dramatic resonance (a major concept if you have patience for high art) that her gaming you is working.

One risk of all this material is you gain a neurological unwillingness to do precisely this when you have to.

I admit this downside to learning all this stuff, as you'll see.

I'm confident it can be overcome though and that recognizing these problems in order to overcome them is a key teaching tool.

Vibe - "How to act so they continue to want you to stay once you've hooked" or "How I learned to stop worrying and love myself"

good eye contact frame control leading just being yourself kino some other good stuff like that including maybe a nice zen state and a positive, confident attitude

These things kind of belong in hook also, but you'll practice them more in vibing, which almost sounds like damage control for "over-hooking"

Most importantly, drop any conscious use of the material after a few minutes, like five. There are no hard and fast rules here though.

Instead of creating the coquettish, rapport-breaking vibe (the above type of humor often accomplishes that, but it's important not to go too far overboard, which is the main point of calibration in hook material, to stress it just yet again), qualify as necessary and assume rapport.

Be genuinely you, be nice to her, maybe compliment her looks, in fact try anything that you feel like especially if youhave been suppressing it to get the hook material down.

It's really better not to try and get "vibe material" to simply add to hook material. Instead, vibe and talk about stories that would be interesting to everyone. Tell them to guys, girls, whoever just to learn to be talkative (on the one hand) and not a jibber-jabber (at the other end). Learning to taste every word before you speak it can be an interesting exercise, especially if you drink while sarging.

But be the self that can hook them again if you start to lose the vibe. In other words, naturalize the hook material which makes them want you to stay until these powerful verbalizations are (often, but not always) the obvious choice in a momentary lull to ramp up attraction again.

That is, if you're willing to put in the work, despite the risks, to attain the reward, which I can only say I believe exists based on my experience.