They burned her at the stake for Chris. There’s no “oh Chris manipulated her. He’s a grown man going after a 16 year old!”

Well to be fair there are a few that point that out.

Plus Haley had to grovel hard to get Nathan back. It’s not like she just got him back Willy Nilly

For Nathan, he got manipulated by Carrie and Rachel and Taylor and Dan. Always manipulated by someone else to be against Haley

But for Haley? No that shits her fault only

Yeah it seems because those two started off mean, so their growth is seen as good and mistake is justified

But the others who started off nicer (Haley, Lucas) any mistake is crucified

I dunno where Peyton falls

She was in the middle. Nicer than Brathan but not at Laley levels 😂

They definitely baby him. It reminds me of reality where women get crucified in the workplace, at home, in the media and men get away with murder

Funny though, Lucas does get criticized. I wonder why people are open to that?

I’m not blaming him for being manipulated. I’m saying when Haley is manipulated, that’s just her fault only

And to realize how often he gets manipulated but when Haley gets manipulated, she’s per usual crucified

Also I am blaming him for how easily he goes against Haley. Like how he believed Dan when he called her a baby trapper

When Haley tries to kick Taylor out, he steps in and stops her. That’s her sister not his to determine that.

And every time I bring this up, people jump and do all kinds of gymnastics as to why he did what he did

Anything Haley does is because she’s a bitch or a prude or self righteous.

No insight for her like there is for Nathan

Where am I blaming the victim?

No one says that when Haley gets criticized. When she’s manipulated by an adult predator Chris when she’s only 16.

What about her absentee parents and how she felt when Nathan became absentee when his dream was lost

He flirted with Peyton on auction night, he flirted with Carrie (Quentin points it out), he wouldn’t have said what he said if haley were around

He almost sleeps with Taylor and definitely had the intention to. She left him to go on tour and said maybe they rushed things.

That’s why it’s okay that Nathan left without saying goodbye and going straight to Taylor right?

I added to the comment where I stated some cases where Nathan easily goes against Haley because of what Dan or Taylor do

For Haley, Chris would manipulate. Sometimes Dan and Taylor too

Again where did I blame Nathan for being depressed?

But mental illness doesn’t take away accountability. Especially not when you’re a parent

Yes point that out and people will say you’re victim blaming.

Nathan was the victim in all this.

But when Haley as a 16 year old got preyed on by an adult predator Chris. She’s never called a victim there

Because of that, Nathan is justified in how he treats Haley even when he called her a baby trapper

I don’t know about that.

I’m talking about how fans in this sub treat Haley versus Nathan

I never made claims about how the characters consider Haley versus Nathan

In the oth world, that’s not the case. And I never said that was the case in the show

Don’t forget anytime Nathan flirts or cheats: “well Haley kissed Chris so she needs to get off her high horse”

If it’s the same then why not just call it a break up

Instead of taking a break

Why make the distinction if it’s the same?

So you’re saying Nathan and Haley were free to sleep with whoever at that point?

And it would be unquestionable?

I don’t think the majority would agree

He already fell back on bad behavior by going to taylors bar in the first place

And then he judges Taylor and basically calls her a whore

No it’s not a break up. They’re married. It wasn’t a break up until they separated

And even then, neither of them could cheat again or else their marriage would’ve ended

Probably what stopped Nathan from sleeping with taylor last minute

Doesn’t he let Taylor grind on his crotch while dancing on the bar table

He also flirts with Carrie at the bar which Quentin tells him to be careful about

He also flirts with Peyton in auction night

All that is okay because Haley kissed Chris and left Nathan to go on tour

I thought you said you agreed Chris is a predator but you don’t say Haley got kissed by her abuser?

I guess that’s just me

Someone literally called me a victim blamer when I pointed that out about Nathan!

How dare I hold Nathan the victim accountable for his actions?

No I don’t think it was okay for her to throw glasses. So don’t put words in my mouth

I didn’t say Haley does no wrong

I said Nathan gets away with a lot and only Haley is judged harshly when she makes mistakes

I’m not like you where I can’t see that both mess up and just put it all on one

My bad, I’m pretty passive aggressive in general so a lot of times I don’t notice until someone says it

I thought I was doing better

Ross and Rachel weren’t married though but that’s another debate. He slept with someone so quickly after the break and that’s why it became an issue

Plus a break and a break up is different

You’re not single on a break. Break means relationship is in tact but taking a breather from each other to clear the head

If we have the different view on Ross and Rachel, then that means we simply have a different perspective on it all

I accept that Haley made terrible mistakes

I can even say it unlike some people with Nathan

She has the ticket booked. He tells her don’t bother coming home and I don’t want you home so she respects his boundary

It wasn’t a day after first of all

She didn’t know it was a suicide attempt. She thought it was an accident.

And he tells her don’t bother coming home when she catches a flight. Then he sends her annulment papers

All this happens before the tickling

Guess you conveniently forgot that since Nathan can do no wrong

Yes!

Are you finally acknowledging that or being sarcastic because I can’t tell

Oh I didn’t know that

Can you tell me about it?

I’ve watch the office but I didn’t know the fan views

I edit them within second because of extra ideas that come

I figure you’re too busy looking at Nathan through rose colored glasses to notice 😂

And you just edited your comment too so what ? So what’s the point of bringing that up

You justify grinding but got a problem with tickling

Yeah he did. When they have that class assignment and he flirts with her then. And she flirts a little back too. He takes her to the school gym, and shows her how he carved her initials there and he’s all we were pretty good together. Etc

Haley didn’t dump him. She said maybe they rushed things. So again you’re gonna justify how he left without goodbye and went straight to Haley’s trouble making sister who he had already slept with and had the intention with sleeping with again at one point during that night

Her couch time didn’t include grinding on Chris’ penis but sure that’s the same thing to you I guess

Yeah hence why you shouldn’t be comparing their depression in the first place

Also all depression is not equal

It comes in varying levels and intensities

Even post partum depression varies between mothers

Fans in this sub did not respond differently. They blame Haley for not being supportive of Nathan even when he’s an absentee parent

Uninvolved in both Haley’s and Jamie’s life

Many define flirting as cheating. It is showing sexual or romantic interest in another

So have I but in society and by law, you can’t say you have depression and become negligent towards your kid and that’s for good reason

For the safety of the child.

That goes for Haley too

Haley doesn’t stop being a parent when her mom dies. She messes up by yelling at Jamie while they bake together but they’re baking together because she is still present as his parent

Also Haley’s depression from mom death is incomparable to Nathan’s depression from a dream lost from his own poor decisions with violence

They should be treated kindly but they should also still be held accountable.

You don’t become absolved of any action because of mental illness barring insanity or something like that

Flirting is considered cheating by many as flirting means showing romantic/sexual interest