The penultimate candidate in our Tory Leadership Special interviews is /u/_paul_rand_, the Education Secretary. Formerly a Libertarian Party member, he rose to the position of Party President before he was expelled from the Party in January 2019 over allegations he attempted to coup leader /u/Friedmanite19. Having subsequently joined the Conservatives, the MP for Northumbria has been a mainstay in Tory Cabinets ever since. But is the leap to the top job a bridge too far for /u/_paul_rand_? The Times spoke to him earlier this evening.

UH: /u/_paul_rand_, thank you for joining me. What are your core ideological principles?

PR: My core ideological principle is one nation conservatism. Some people might consider that just to be a soundbite but when we look at what it really is, it’s a comprehensive ideological framework.

For me, one nation conservatism is an ideology where the core tenet is the power of the individual, it then considers how by empowering the individual we can empower the community and vice versa. We, as one nation conservatives, support equality of opportunity as expressed through the free market with minimal state intervention. And we always take a long term, pragmatic view on the key battles of our age

UH: What’s the most pressing issue facing the party at the moment? How are you going to solve it?

PR: Lack of vision, plain and simple. It’s lack of vision that has lead to every single problem we face, lack of activity? Because we don’t know where we stand. Lack of accountability? Because no one is inspired to hold key figures to account. Lack of coherence? Again from a lack of vision.

The way I’d solve this is simple. I’d use myself as a model. If one looks at my work as education secretary they can see that I have clear agendas I work on, there is always an end goal in mind. I don’t pick policies and fit agendas to them, I start with the agenda and I fit policies to them. That’s what’s been missing, in my manifesto I’ve provided details on a process that will help us to develop agendas in each policy areas which could allow us to deliver a coherent and comprehensive vision.

If you want to know what that’d look like I’d refer you to my time as education secretary, curriculum reform for breadth, depth and rigour, equality of opportunity through a reformed schools budget and hopefully we can see accountability reform by the end of this term, and of course ensuring that schools are properly staffed and resourced. You can see evidence of all these themes in my work as education secretary and I’d seek to apply this to every policy area. Multi term projects with a clear end goal

UH: What - if any - reforms would you make to the internal party machinery?

PR: When I joined the party, I was in awe at the machinery we had, it’s had a bit of wear and tear and it’s slowly grinding to a halt. It’s not too late to fix it.

I think having a functioning and sustainable press office is vital, and I think that would be a Major first port of call for us, press can very quickly set the narrative, and it’s important for us to dominate the narrative if we are going to maintain our position as the premier force in British politics, announcing and supporting a new press officer who has the experience, commitment and consistency to deliver the coherent press strategy I’ve outlined in my manifesto would be one of my first ports of call.

Secondly, once we’ve devised our agendas for each department we are going to need a policy platform to back it up so the chair is going to have a big job In ensuring we have the long term policy strategies (likely over multiple manifestos ) to deliver our end points. That’s going to be a big job and we should make sure the chair has everything they need to do that, whether that be a vice or just support from leadership.

UH: Who are our natural bedfellows in coalition?

PR: Well I think the plural in the question gives it away. We have two natural partners as a centre right party.

To the centre we have the Liberal Democrats who have proven themselves to be immensely reliable, productive and amicable partners in coalition. I think any leader would be fatally unwise to alienate them in anyway. Whether we win or lose the VoNC, they must remain close partners.

And to the right, we have the LPUK. Relations have taken a hit sure, but it’s nothing that’s irreparable. If we look at the noises out of the LPUK, it’s our lack of vision that has put them off, they don’t know what we stand for and thus they feel as if we abandon them and then use them. That’s why I, as I expressed in my manifesto, a key element of repairing relations must be being clear about what we stand for.

I’ve been part of a healthy relationship with the LPUK firsthand in Scotland, and that was predicated on us being open and clear with the LPUK about what we believed, none of this “we’ll agree to it only to repeal it a term later”. We lose respect, principle and anger our natural partners when we do that.

UH: Who are your greatest political inspirations?

PR: From the time before the events that lead to the current state of the House of Commons, I’d name Liz Truss, Michael Gove and David Cameron as some of my key inspirations. Liz Truss especially for me showed how one nation conservatism can be combined with a solid influence of both liberalism and libertarianism, and how conservatism is as principled as it is pragmatic. Obviously Gove’s effectiveness as a political operator and his views on education have enticed me. And Cameron would be a model for me to follow if I were to become Prime Minster, of how a vision based in the principles of one nation conservatism can deliver no matter the political climate.

Since joining the Conservative party I have had the great privilege to see real figures who will be remembered in British history for their monumental impact up close and personal and their impact upon me and the inspiration they give me is immense. Figures like u/InfernoPlato and u/DrCeasarMD who have a wealth of experience under their belt and are as firm as they are fair when providing guidance, but also more recently figures such as u/eelsemaj99 and u/model-mili who are also monumental figures and who remain as candid with me as others when they provide guidance. I am privileged to consider some of my greatest inspirations as good friends.

UH: You were expelled for plotting against your leader in your last party. Don’t we need a leader who will be rowing in the same direction as his colleagues, not trying to coup them for personal gain?

PR: That question is unfortunately based on a faulty base. There are three problems with this:

1 - It was by no means for personal gain, there were dangerous individuals in the party who threatened to drag the LPUK to a dangerous place, I’m sure if you look at the full screenshots you would be able to see that in reality I was more concerned about getting the dangerous individuals in question out of an otherwise sound party, These individuals were damaging to the party and were given too many chances and me and the other individual implicated wanted nothing more than the stability of the party

2 - The evidence that was used by the party leader had been cropped to rig the vote, something confirmed by senior LPUK figures to me privately at the time as you would be able to see on the old MTwitter, I voluntarily released the full screenshots to the public for scrutiny as I personally had nothing to hide

3 - I’d deny that we were at a stage where it could be considered a coup, we were just making sure we had our hand right if the party leadership was not willing to take action against divisive individuals who were harming our party repeatedly.

Do I think the issue was regrettable, absolutely. Do I want to move on from it, absolutely. Has progress been made on moving on from it, once again absolutely me and Fried [/u/Friedmanite19] have worked together in 2 Westminster governments and a Scottish government.

I am a leader who is more than capable of rowing in the same direction as my colleagues that’s exactly why I’m one of only candidates who is repeatedly emphasising the collaborative nature of the formation of a vision, it’s not for me to decide, it’s for the party.

As leader, my interest will only be that of the nation and the party.

UH: What’s to stop you betraying your new party in the same way? Can your deputies be confident that you won’t try something underhand like you did in the LPUK?

What’s to stop anyone betraying their party that way? The fact that they know me as a person and that I haven’t actually ever done anything underhanded whilst they’ve known me, I’ve always been loyal to the party line and leadership. Not only can my deputies be confident, but the whole party can be confident that I will continue to behave above reproach as I always have, the incident in the LPUK, when dealt with in a nuanced manner amounted to nothing more than two party members discussing how to remove dangerous members (reminder that this was within my remit as party president at the time), what would happen if the party leader revoked power granted to me by a clear democratic mandate and life after Friedmanite retires. While my rhetoric may have been regrettable and there was times my temper was inflamed with Friedmanite, I hold that what I did was not a coup attempt. But fundamentally I think everyone involved would like to move on since my clear track record of loyalty to the party speaks more volumes than an incident which attracted the LPUK, notably not me, more criticism

UH: You’ve spoken a great deal about one nation conservatism, as have a lot of candidates. Aren’t you being a bit disingenuous given that until last year, you were a Libertarian?

Well that’s an interesting question. When I was in the libertarians I was definitely considered a significantly more moderate leaning member, to the point the term “liberaltarian” was more appropriate.

Now that makes the question more about what the difference is between a “liberaltarian” and a one nation conservative and I’d argue it’s more about the lens through which one views the same ideas. Libertarians tend to view things through a more ideological lens, and that’s totally acceptable and I did used to view things through a more ideological lens. But now I would argue that serving in government and seeing the places where real change happens, seeing how real change happens, makes your views change. It forces you to consider practicality, and that makes you more pragmatic naturally.

So no, I don’t think that’s disingenuous. Of course everyone’s views shift slightly as the climate changes and due to increasing personal experience but the only fundamental change I’d argue has happened is that I see the issues through a more long term and pragmatic lens.

UH: So this sudden change to a more centre-right ideology isn’t you pandering to Tory members, then?

If this was sudden and unexpected you could argue that, but I don’t think anyone would realistically argue that I haven’t become more pragmatic and willing to compromise since I’ve entered into government. Tory members who know me personally will know that I hold my principles dear and will always strive for them with vigour. If I was pandering members would see through it.

Having said that, I do think a degree of ideological flexibility is required, and I can appreciate that, as with any leader, at times my views may differ from the parties on a specific issue. If elected, it is my duty to be a leader that follows the vision as decided by the party.

So no, I don’t think there has been a sudden change, I think it’s been a gradual shift and I think it finished many months ago, as I’m sure my recorded positions will show

UH: You spend a whole page talking about the LPUK and a potential coalition in your manifesto, relegating the Lib Dems to just one paragraph. Isn’t that a bit of an insult to the party we are currently in Government with?

Without meaning any offence I’d argue that’s an incredibly misinformed question. It completely ignores the political landscape that we find ourselves in. There are very significant problems in our relationship with the LPUK that need to be rectified and I had to make proposals on how to do so. That’s very different to the situation with the Lib Dems where all I have to say is that they have been brilliant coalition partners and we must keep them close and not alienate them, as some would do, with their approach to relations with the LPUK by not being clear with them when it matters.

If anything I’d argue the Liberal Democrats should take it as a sincere compliment.

UH: Your manifesto talks about a more active press strategy, but aren’t we already doing that? We have The Spectator, /u/Yukub writing in The Times, InfernoPlato producing posters - what’s missing here?

Once again, nuance. A more active press strategy. I’m not saying there’s no press, and I’m not saying that it isn’t improving. Luckily the rises in labour polling, VoNC and this Leadership election have motivated us a bit and the next leader will have some energy to work with. But let’s not let good enough become the enemy of better. We need more reactive press statements setting out the party narrative directly, the last press release was 80 days ago, in 80 days a hell of a lot has happened. And if this VoNC means we become the official opposition we will need to be the dominant force in the press holding the government to account and showing a way forward that is better than the coalition of chaos that labour will cobble together.

There’s once again one key thing missing: direction. There’s no direction, we are trying to cobble together a press strategy and individuals are doing their part but we need to have a clearly directed and orchestrated strategy otherwise we will lose control of the narrative.

I think any leader who wouldn’t want us to do significantly better than we are doing right now would be leading the party on a bad path.

UH: Shouldn’t you practice what you preach? /u/BrexitGlory has been very active in the press, even before this leadership race, Yukub as well - when was the last time you posted in the press before this leadership contest?

Well before this leadership contest I’d started work on a detailed press piece on the VONC that will be finished and promptly come out before the vote commences as the intention is to sway the undecided. It’s something we’ve all had our problems with, but I’d argue that it’s not necessarily individual press activity that is the problem, which is what I’ve just said. It’s the lack of direction, it’s the lack of coordination. I have experience with the press, transparency and accountability is something I took personal responsibility for as deputy first minister in Scotland and it was a key plan of my administration as leader of the Scottish conservatives, I know the benefits of a solid press strategy and direction is how you achieve one

UH: But you don’t know when you last did anything in the press?

PR: I’m aware of the last thing I did in the press yes, As CEO of the Financial Times I provided detailed analysis of our electoral fortunes based on constituency polling back in January, we were working on a comprehensive piece on Brexit after the issues with u/vitiating but that collapsed with the change in government.

UH: What I’m getting at is the idea that you simply aren’t active enough to be leader. Former PM and party leader eelsemaj99, whose judgement I’m sure we both respect greatly, gave you just 2.5/5 for activity in his assessment of the candidates. 4 months since your last press post, regarded as inactive by your colleagues - do you really have the commitment to keep us at the top?

PR: I don’t honestly believe that I am regarded as inactive. If you once again deal with the nuance of what my good friend said, he said he was worried about the consistency, not the quantity. So let’s look at that in the run up to this campaign, historically yes it’s been a problem due to my well documented struggles with mental illness, but as these issues are being ameliorated you can see the consistency increase.

Just before the last election, I produced an extensive, and heavily researched white paper to allow the commons to debate on it, I’ve heeded the concerns raised and I’m now working on an improved version. Around and During the election, there was a one off family emergency unrelated to the problems that have been regarded as a cause of my inactivity, this has been the only recent blip . As a senior member of the Scottish government I have been focused significantly on the infrastructure and green investment strategy which will be presented to Parliament in the new few weeks and even after considering my extensive commitments in Holyrood, which would be reduced if I were to be elected, I still score third in terms of Commons word count as pointed out by none other than BrexitGlory. So I’d argue that if we are really actually worried about commitment, you can see an extensive and recent track record before this election of activity and commitment.

So absolutely, I do have the commitment, I have the energy and importantly I have the ideas with the most detailed manifesto of any candidate. Furthermore, if we are to consider the specifics of the article in question, the endorsement was given to someone who has a lower Commons word count since the QS than me, and had a marginally higher activity score due to his longer presence, I don’t think my activity is at all a problem for people to get behind me and trust me to lead them

UH: Do you have anything else you’d like to say?

PR: Well I’d like to give a summary of what my responses are to the issues you’ve raised. Can you trust me as your leader? ask yourself and I’m sure you’ll find the answer to be yes. Have I shown ideological consistency? Absolutely. Am I active enough? Hell yes, I’m active enough. I think the manner in which I’ve been able to competently deal with every possible flaw that you could have drawn attention to, shows that I can be your leader.

But I’d like to remind people that it is not just my skills as a leader that make me the right choice, it is my comprehensive strategy that I have set out in my manifesto. I am the right choice to reignite the flame of conservatism and I urge every member of my party to heed my call to arms.

UH: /u/_paul_rand_, thank you very much.

PR: Thank you for the opportunity.

/u/UnexpectedHippo is a Conservative MP, as well as being Executive Director (Operations) at The Times. This is the fourth in a series of interviews, which aims to sit down with all leadership candidates before voting opens on Monday 13th April. You can see the previous interviews in the series with Yukub here; /u/MerrilyPutrid here; /u/model-willem here.