Coming soon - Get a detailed view of why an account is flagged as spam!
view details

This post has been de-listed

It is no longer included in search results and normal feeds (front page, hot posts, subreddit posts, etc). It remains visible only via the author's post history.

12
Is the finnest a McGuffin, a Deus Ex Machina, both or none?
Author Summary
RubberJoshy is in China
Post Body

So I've been seeing a lot of people claiming the Azath is a Deus Ex Machina (DEM).

I disagree, here is why:

For at least half the book it appears that the finnest is the McGuffin (McG) for Lorn and Tool.

So, can something be both McG and a DEM?

Here's the common definition for both:

* In fiction, a MacGuffin (sometimes McGuffin) is an object, device, or event that is necessary to the plot and the motivation of the characters, but insignificant, unimportant, or irrelevant in itself.

*A DEM is a plot device whereby a seemingly unsolvable problem in a story is suddenly or abruptly resolved by an unexpected and unlikely occurrence.

In the face of these I'd posit that:

1) If a seeming McG serves in an active way in the articulation of a plot point, it then ceases to be a McG, as it's no longer "insignificant, unimportant, or irrelevant in itself".

2) If a seeming DEM is expected, likely, or part of a solution thought up in advance by characters, then it ceases to be " a seemingly unsolvable problem in a story [that] is suddenly or abruptly resolved by an unexpected and unlikely occurrence".

Taking this into account, it would appear that the finnest is neither, as it is crucial in solving the endgame problem in an active and somewhat expected and likely way.

However doubt would still remain as the finnest "birthing" an Azath is not explicitly stated as being an expected result of its presence at the Fete; and therein lies the rub:

Are the "expectation" and "likelyhood" of events in the description the reader's or the characters'? In books like MBOTF does the distinction need to be made? Can the distinction be made?

In a book where the narrator and povs are intrinsically unreliable and/or limited (and in general, where most information is intentionally obscured), can we convincingly make the case either way?

I'm not certain it can, but further reading almost always get readers to a place of definite trust in SE's storytelling abilities, so does it even matter?

For what it's worth my vote goes to "not DEM", what's your take?

Author
Account Strength
40%
Account Age
1 year
Verified Email
Yes
Verified Flair
No
Total Karma
454
Link Karma
67
Comment Karma
387
Profile updated: 5 days ago
Posts updated: 1 month ago
3rd readthrough

Subreddit

Post Details

Location
We try to extract some basic information from the post title. This is not always successful or accurate, please use your best judgement and compare these values to the post title and body for confirmation.
Posted
1 year ago