I debated posting this, but after specifically reading a lot of the stuff that /u/madpiratebippy wrote, I decided It'd be worth it to write.

The background is that my mom is a hoarder and probably BPD (borderline personality disorder). Two therapists of mine who met her under the guise of "telling her how I was doing" so they could suss out wtf was up with her both came to that conclusion separately (I didn't tell the 2nd therapist I went to what the first one thought).

My mom did actually get help over the years. Though she never admitted it, she's definitely gone to therapy. I can tell this by the way her language changed in regards to conflict, and by her (greatly) improved behavior and (intellectual) understanding of boundaries.

I've also realized that my mom (being BPD) absolutely, positively still does not GET IT. Not the way that we (empathetic) people do. She understands that taking X shitty abusive/controlling approach now always gets her negative consequences that she doesn't want. She understands that taking Y approach that she doesn't particularly like gets her some degree of the result that she wants, sometimes. But she genuinely does not understand why being a manipulative, controlling, abusive shitty cuntbag gets negative results. She doesn't even understand that she is being a manipulative, controlling abusive shitty cuntbag. In her mind, she's asserting her rights to get what she deserves.

The main reason that my mom started behaving better is that pretty much EVERYBODY in her life, every single person, stopped putting up with her shit. ALL OF THEM. She didn't have anybody who would submit to her bullshit anymore. No one would listen to her complaints about those of us who wouldn't submit to her bullshit. People decided that they'd rather have nothing to do with her, even family members.

I want to just make a point of this again, because it's the most important thing: EVERYBODY stopped enabling her. Everybody. It started with me, and I encouraged my dad, my aunts (my mom's sisters), and everybody else to stop buying her bullshit. At the same time, most of the friendships that my mom had left imploded (She still has some friendships with a few women who NEVER gave into her bullshit and had great boundaries from the beginning. Because those friendships were always healthy, there was nothing in them to take a stand on). When she had absolutely nobody left who would put up with her shit, she started improving.

I can honestly say, from all the awful stories I'd read here, and my own life experience, that if an abusive person like these MILs does have every, single person in their life refuse to cater to their behavior, then they really don't have any reason to stop. If the M/MIL in question has a spouse who is just as bad as they are, then the situation is probably permanently screwed, as long as the spouse is alive, since then they can be you know, against the world together.

In terms of my mom "improving" though, it's not a finished battle. She will try to manipulate again in a heartbeat. If I'm not able/in the mood to be on the lookout for manipulation and stand strong against it, then I don't communicate with her. Because she's not really "better". She just knows that nobody will put up with her shit, and has altered her behavior accordingly.

One of the saddest things I realized about my mom and her broken mind is that a lot of her behavior stems from the fact that she believes that people only have relationships with each other if they want something that she understands from each other. As I got older, and independent, my mom literally couldn't comprehend the idea of why I'd want a relationship with her if I didn't want something from her that only she can give me. Our relationship is basically established on the foundation that she's my mom, and I'd really love to have my mom in my life. BUT, if she treats me certain ways, then she's no longer welcome in my life. So her understanding of our relationship is that I need her to act in certain ways more than I need a relationship with her. If she doesn't act in those ways, we don't have a relationship.

I don't think she actually understands love. Not the way that I do.

Anyways, the main reason I wanted to put this out there is for people who wonder if their MILs can change/get better. Unless everybody more or less forces it on them, my experience says no. The only exception to that would be if the MIL in question decides that having a relationship with their child/grandchildren (assuming that their child/your spouse is willing to go NC with them) is more important to them than being able to indulge in the shit that they so love to pull. If a MIL decides it's worth it, that doesn't not mean that they're better! It only means that they understand (intelligence-wise, not emotion-wise) that they have to behave X way in order to get the result they want.

Honestly, it's like training a dog. The dog doesn't know why you want it to roll over, or sit, or speak. But it gets a treat if it does. So it does those things. For the treat. Not because it's decided that rolling over, or speaking, or shaking hands is fun.

I hope this post doesn't violate the rules in any way. I read them over pretty carefully, and I was pretty sure it didn't. If it does, apologies. As time goes on, I imagine I'll start posting some of the insane stories I have, from before my mom was forced into good behavior. And the occasional, hilarious slip since she has improved. Maybe I'll start with one of those.