Coming soon - Get a detailed view of why an account is flagged as spam!
view details

This post has been de-listed

It is no longer included in search results and normal feeds (front page, hot posts, subreddit posts, etc). It remains visible only via the author's post history.

12
Stormlance Grimoire SB's Potential.
Post Body

I'd like to discuss the potential of Tyro and his new SB. This should also be useful for those trying to decide if they have enough RS coverage to make good use of it. There's a TLDR waaaay at the bottom.

I'm not trying to consider if he is better off using Sentinel Grimoire (Hint: he is). I'm also leaving out any options that require very specific relics, but I do include general categories of relics that I feel everyone will eventually have. I think a lot of veterans already know this stuff, but for players in earlier phases, I hope it highlights SLG's (eventual) potential.

Tyro and Stormlance Grimoire

For Stormlance Grimoire to be viable, Tyro has to be able to do big damage with it, while still contributing meaningfully to the Party when building up his gauge.

The SB stats:

Stormlance Grimoire : 4 Ranged hits of 2 mult lightning physical.

At first glance, this SB seems quite powerful, its hits and multiplier are actually the same as Squall's SSB. It's Lightning element which is good and bad. At second glance, it seems rubbish since it's Tyro and his Atk is meh compared to the likes of Squall. However, by the third glance you might remember :

  • Tyro can equip any weapon, so he is more likely to have RS than anyone.
  • Tyro can use any ability, which means he has more Atk Buff options than most characters.
  • There's a 589 Atk Soft Cap, after which point the effect of Atk is drastically reduced.

So given this, how difficult is it to make Tyro a damage dealing machine?

  • At level 80, Tyro's Atk reaches 107 without EQ (Squall has 170).
  • You can expect to eventually have a bracer and an accessory with at least 20 Atk, for 40 Atk total.
  • Dragoon's Determination is a 1.2 multiplier to Atk. Below the soft cap, the 40% damage increase is preferable to Tidus RM3.
  • After a while, you can expect to accrue duplicate 4* melees to combine, and a few 5*s. Ignoring daggers, you can expect as low as the below Atk values with RS, but usually higher.

    Relic Rank Atk(RS)
    4* 125
    4* 150
    4* 180
    5* 190
  • We have the following noteworthy abilities to boost Atk, none of which stack with each other.

    Ability Multiplier
    Steal Power ( Lowers enemy Atk ) 50%
    Punishing Palm (applies 2.1 of phys damage) 30%
    Boost ( can be equipped on other party members ) 25%

Now to compare performance for each weapon rank. I'll also include normal attack damage and total SB damage to Ultimate Exdeath.

Comparison to Squall

For comparison lets look at Squall, and his similar SSB. With the Bracelet, Accessory, and SSB mastery, Lv80 Squall has 220 Atk without weapons, and we can give him DD RM and have someone Boost him for 1.2*1.25=1.5 Atk.

Equipped Weapon Modified Atk Attack Dam SSB Dam
4* 517 3330 26642
4* 555 3777 30218
4* 600 4251 34015
5* 615 4304 34438

Steal Power

With Bracelet and Accessories, Lv80 Tyro has 147Atk, and we can give him DD RM and Steal Power for an Atk multiplier of 1.2*1.5 = 1.8

Equipped Weapon Modified Atk Attack Dam SLG Dam
4* 489 3014 24113
4* 534 3531 28248
4* 588 4198 33590
5* 606 4275 34202

As equipment Atk gets higher, Tyro gets comparatively better ( I could explain this with graphs and gradients instead, but fuck it, you get tables ). This trend will hold until Atk is high enough for Squall to hit the softcap without DD RM and can replace it ( that's REALLY high ). You have to give up a damage turn to use Steal Power, but you don't have to slot boost or power breakdown into your party. Tyro's damage is also (borderline) decent enough for a dedicated retaliate build if you bring defense debuffs.

Punishing Palm

You could also use Punishing Palm instead of Steal Power. So no Atk debuff on the boss, and a lower Atk multiplier, 1.2*1.3=1.56, but you deal damage on your buff turn.

Equipped Weapon Modified Atk Attack Dam PuP Damage SLG Dam
4* 424 2329 4892 18637
4* 463 2729 5731 21833
4* 510 3245 6815 25962
5* 525 3426 7194 27409

Not as impressive for SLG, but we'll have to compare full rotations to see the whole story.

Skill Rotation

Since I'm trying to evaluate SLG SB, lets pretend Life Siphon is out ( 1.8 multiplier ), and it's your slot 2 ability. PuP and Steal power are both 25 seconds duration, which easily fits 2 Life Siphons and a re-buff. So :

  • Damage with a 4* over a PuP rotation is (2.1 1.8 1.8) * 3245 = 18498.
  • Damage with a 4* over a Steal Power rotation is (0 1.8 1.8) * 4198 = 15115.

Both Steal Power and PuP charge SB by 55, and Life Siphon by 150, one rotation gets you 355/500 of a gauge. Depending on how often you get hit you can expect an SB every 1-1.5 rotations. Overall, Steal Power wins with its stronger SLG, and you also get to focus more burst damage where ever you choose to. Life Siphon will remain the best damage option until we get the better 5* phys abilities and can hone them.

As Atk gets higher, PuP rotation gains, as Steal Power puts you further above the soft cap and PuP brings you closer to it. I've already put so many numbers in this post, I'll just say that if your Tyro has at least 352 Atk with Equipment ( possible with a strong 5* ), then having DD RM and a PuP rotation can do more damage than a Steal Power rotation ( but you can't focus as much burst damage, and lose the Atk debuff ).

You also don't necessarily have to focus on building your SB gauge, Tyro can still do decent damage, and just throw out less SLGs. You could slot a breakdown for instance, they have a decent 2.1 multiplier. Working out the most effective role is party and battle dependent, and left as an exercise for the reader.

Closing

Unfortunately I don't know if Ultimate Exdeath's defense stat is indicative of future Ultimate stats, but no matter the Boss defense, Tyro's relative power to the heavy hitters won't change, so that comparison remains valid. Tyro will gain more from stronger equip options than most others. Maybe not Bartz, but I mean, come on, its Bartz.

Party make up and the particular adds a lot of complication to this. As the lucky few start adding in certain rarer SBs ( the AoE Atk buffs, Phys SSBs ), Tyro will start falling behind again ( rather the others gain back ). You might want someone else to bring Power Breakdown, or bring a Power Breakdown SB, or the boss simply doesn't use Phys, all of which lowers Steal Power's value. You're concentrating a lot of resources on Tyro that you might want to spread out. The other items on the beginner banner might be more helpful to you right now.

While I'm not going to say SLG is the best weapon on the beginner banner, I hope I have at least helped you work out if it can be effective in your own party compositions.

Foot note : Dark Raid

In 5 months we get Dark Raid ( 2.2 mult Dark Phys, 1.3 Atk mod, 0.7 Def mod ), that stacks with all Atk Buffs. When it comes out, only Tyro will be able to stack it with Steal Power, and only Tyro and Jecht with PuP. This will let him do pretty decent damage in the 2nd ability slot, against Dark/Lightning neutral bosses. It might also free up your RM slot, while still having a strong, rarer SLG. In a long battle a Life Siphon build will likely do more damage overall, unless Tyro gets hit a lot or can use an SB related RM, but it's a cool, competitive option.

TLDR

With specific setups, and with good RS melee ( at least 4* ), Tyro's SB with Steal Power and Atk RM can compete with the physical SSBs as long as the enemy is at least Lightning neutral. If you reach 352 Atk with Equipment, Punishing Palm can be a better option for overall DPS, but with less saved up burst damage. Life Siphon is generally the best option for your 2nd ability in terms of damage.

I'm not saying that SLG is better or equal to the physical SSBs, but it is competitive. I can't even say if its the most efficient choice on the beginner banner for you. If you already have a physical SSB, I think you're already golden. If there's one SSB that you are going to draw heavy for (especially Lightning's as it's the same element), maybe forget about this one, or leave your decision till after that banner has passed ( we have till Sept ! ). Otherwise, you have this as an option if you want to get into the Life Siphon 'Meta', or just want to focus on making Tyro a good Damage dealer.

Author
Account Strength
100%
Account Age
9 years
Verified Email
Yes
Verified Flair
No
Total Karma
47,368
Link Karma
1,311
Comment Karma
45,722
Profile updated: 4 days ago
Posts updated: 10 months ago
Eiko

Subreddit

Post Details

We try to extract some basic information from the post title. This is not always successful or accurate, please use your best judgement and compare these values to the post title and body for confirmation.
Posted
9 years ago