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I recently had a run in with some severely anti kink feminists who argued certain hard kinks (i.e edgeplay like CNC) should be outright banned because it perpetuates misogyny and is inherently violent. Now, I'm a trans woman who has quite a bit of trauma, and I use kinks like CNC to help make the buzzing in my brain go away, and I found it quite weird that people repeatedly refused to acknowledge that these kinks also exist in lesbian contexts, I was mostly just wondering about people's opinions on whether or not you can really call, say, two trans women engaging in hard kink "perpetuating misogyny" in the same way as if it were happening between a cis man and a cis woman.
Personally, I think the idea that hard kinks should be banned outright is ridiculous, and I'd certainly hope that most people here would also have that view. What I'm really interested in is people's philosophical takes on whether or not you can really say that these kinks perpetuate violence. Extreme kinks are, in my experience, fairly common in trans lesbian spaces (I don't really have any experience with cis spaces) so I've kind of had these thoughts brewing for a while. I understand that obviously these kinks exist in a patriarchal cultural context, but surely the same can be said of literally all sexual proclivities, and I'm not seeing many people (worth listening to) suggesting that all atypical forms of sex be done away with.
To clarify. In my eyes, the question is one of semiotics, where does the libidinal investment for taboo kinks comes from? I think it originates within the culture and spreads to the context of sex, rather than the other way around, but in open to hearing other people's views
Sorry, I kind of got a bit rambly there. TLDR: what's everyone's opinion on the question of "misogynist" kinks, particularly when they exist in lesbian contexts like that? Is it normalising violence like some anti kink feminists say, or do you believe that these kinks can be isolated to the spaces in which they're conducted (i.e, within the relationship and with regular discussion of limits, consent, comfortability etc)
How is it not ridiculous? How are you going to enforce that?
Rich of you to assume that they are the uninformed one.
Watching is participating in the mind, though? I agree that men watching porn usually identify with the men in cishet porn, so if you're talking about maledom, then with the dom (the fact that femdom exists is irrelevant at this point). The points I wrote in my first comment are not specific to a sub experiencing a violent scene, they include the dom side just as well.
Do you mind reading the last sentence of my comment, too?
As I said, really weird that you have encountered it so much and I haven't. Maybe different demographics or different parts of the world and different culture, I don't know.
Concerning me not knowing what others do outside of what they do with me: Yeah oviously, just the same as you. This is why I mentioned both firsthand experience and secondhand experience.
The scene they described is violent, yes. But the core of violent scenes is not so much about the physical part, but about control, about trust (the person puts themselves into this position knowing that I will beat them, but not more than they can take), about release (think fight club), about the sensation part and what it does to you (the physical feeling of pain, pleasure and their respective edges), and that's just off the top of my head.
I do kink and I'm a switch and a verse, so if you have any questions about one of the perspectives, feel free to ask. It's sometimes a bit difficult, like being asked to describe how chicken tastes to a vegetarian, but I can certainly try.
Trigger warning: CNC and its effects on the psyche
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In my experience with assault and sexual assault scenes, which I have done in both perpetrator and victim roles, the victim role is rather empowering because, as the commenter above you described, you regain control. You decide the parameters of this scene beforehand, you can stop it any time, you can try anything you wouldn't do during a real assault. The perpetrator role, however, is pretty difficult on the psyche. You empathise with the victim and especially if they show genuine reactions, it can be terrifying. I would definitely only recommend domming in such scenes if you're very experienced and also if you know your partner really well.
That's really weird. I have never once in my life experienced a dom violating consent, grooming, messing up aftercare, ghost or go for barely legal teens first hand. Outside of online spaces, I have ONE second-hand experience, namely a friend of mine thought that it's OK for a dom to disregard a boundary in certain situations (outside of medical emergenices, in which case they obviously can and should, that was not the discussion).
Because of that, I am wondering why you think that not only does it happen regularly, but that even MOST doms do these things.
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I disagree that CNC doesn't exist without rape culture, for the following reasons:
The way I see it, CNC is just one of many "I control you" and "I do aversive things to you" variations. There are variations in many forms (uncomfortable positions, pain, tickling, orgasm denial, training dog commands etc etc) and this one is about sexual boundaries.
Rape culture does add a layer to it, namely that it's a very very sensitive topic since that exact thing is happening in real life while it's rather rare for someone to, say, get stuffed into a box and tickled against their will.