Tl;dr in bold below.

I'm continuously surprised by how many people absolutely LOVE the Spider-Verse movies. And I quite enjoyed them, myself. But it seems like there's a growing sentiment among superhero fans that not only are they the best Spider-Man movies ever, but among the best superhero movies and animated movies, outright, of all time. And I just can't agree with that. I find them entertaining, and audiovisual treats, but I don't think they're really firing on all levels that movies held in their esteem should really be firing on:

1. Into the Spider-Verse - So, again, impeccable animation quality with a unique style (styles, rather) replete with a catchy soundtrack and likable central character. No argument there. And I don't have an issue with the more random Spider-Verse characters that pop in later (Noir, Ham, etc.) which operate as kind of a mere plot device and visual/tonal curveball. What I do have a problem with is how they handle characters other than Miles, in terms of how contrived it makes things seem. MJ, for example. Her husband's been killed, and she attends the farcical charity memorial put on by his killer? I don't understand that. Why would she be there? Well, the movie needs her there to push 'Peter B.' in a certain direction, so that's why she's there, character logic be damned. Aunt May probably fares the worst in terms of character logic, considering how ready, willing, and able she is to 'jump in the chair' to help Miles Morales, a 15-year old kid, put himself in the line of fire of the people who killed her nephew. She acts like a walking, talking plot device, not a human being. She's like "Finally, I've been waiting for my time to shine, oh yeah, let's do this" levels of pumped about, again, helping another kid become Spider-Man. Why? Because Miles needs to become Spider-Man. Lastly, Gwen Stacy. Integral to her character background is the death of her best friend, Peter Parker. Well here's Peter Parker, identical to the one you lost, Gweneth. Yeah, he's not your Peter Parker, but that's basically like telling Peter Parker "He's not your Uncle Ben" here, in terms of significance. I can't imagine Peter coming across an identical multiverse version of Uncle Ben and just no-selling it, emotionally. But, you know what? It's not Gwen's movie, she's just there to help Miles along in his, so she doesn't get her own character agency...

2. Across the Spider-Verse - In terms of humor, it's probably a step up from its predecessor. The Spot is a hilarious villain who also manages the rare feat of going from funny bad guy to OP'd bad guy without the former undermining the latter. Kudos to the team for that. I can't really recall whether the animation or music was as cool this time because it probably just wouldn't stand out in retrospect as much as the novel experience of the first film. But I'm sure all that is stellar and just as good, objectively. No complaints on that end. The complaints are still with the characters. To their credit, they've at least given Gwen more character agency this time. She has her own motivations and isn't just beholden to behave in accordance to where the plot is going; she's able to impact it. That said, Captain Stacy pulling the "You have the right to remain silent" whole holding a gun on his own daughter is Soap Opera levels of melodrama. That didn't work. Nor did the ending, because there isn't one. The best 2nd chapters find at least a way to end the film, but this one just stops with all the balls in the air, which isn't uncommon. Little too serialized for my taste, there aren't any self-contained themes or stories in the movie. I'd have to throw the BS flag on a superhero movie wrapping its plot around "canon events; protect the canon". That's too nebulous, metta, and on-the-nose for me, not to mention we lose sight of the villain - the best part of the movie - for the whole time we're dealing with that. It also makes Miles look like the only heroic Spider-Man (save for Gwen, ultimately). Even 'Peter B.', our guy, even he was in on it. "We let people die for the greater good!" That's anti-Spider-Man. I can see some of them getting with that program, but Peter Parker?!? Ugh...he was a good depiction, too. But that makes no sense for him. The worst couple of contrived characterizations is with Miles' parents, though. They're like "Where's Miles? Does he love us?" And Gwen says (I'm paraphrasing all of this) "Of course he does, but he can't come home right now." "Bring him home, Gwen." Like, what? They don't know he's Spider-Man, trapped in another dimension, right? They think he's just a normal kid. How has Jeff not put an APB out on his kid? How has Rio not filed a missing person's report? This is not how parents react to runaway teenagers! This would be total panic mode for them! They should be canvasing the street lights, his dad should be kicking in doors looking for this kid. Wtf, Amber Alert, maybe?!

Anyway, I just don't feel like live action films could get away with most of these things, while the unique audiovisual experience of these animated films seems to have blinded people to their numerous narrative problems and lack of general logic in the storytelling. Idk, just my view on it. It probably sounds like I'm taking it seriously, but only seriously enough to compare it to what I think are better films in this genre. I just wrote it up to tell y'all they're good movies and all, but they ain't all that...c'mon. I'm sure y'all will downvote me to oblivion, but I don't have a problem with that. It's whatever. I haven't found a real use for Reddit karma yet, so chip away.